Wengen to Torino?

Old Oct 29th, 2014, 03:37 PM
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Wengen to Torino?

Hi, We are planning our next trip to Europe for Sept. 2015. We will be landing in Zurich and spending the first week or so in Wengen. Since we have 11 days before our reservations in Rapallo, we are thinking to spend some time in the Piedmont area of Italy......without a car.
We would like to go from Wengen to Torino somehow, avoiding the long train tunnel and instead going over the Simplon Pass (I think that is the name, looking at my map). We are open to other suggestions as to how to make this trip.
Also, is Torino a good base for 3 days or so without a car? Any other ideas? (We will be be spending a few days in Genoa before Rapallo).
This forum is always so helpful, and was crucial in planning our trips for the last 2 years. So thank you all, and thanks in advance for any ideas you can share.
Pam
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Old Oct 30th, 2014, 12:30 PM
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There are tons of extremely scenic itineraries, for example via Interlaken - Meiringen - Swiss Post Bus - Grimsel Pass - Furka Pass - Gotthard Pass - train - Milan - Turin.
If you can afford to spend 2 days, you may travel via Golden Pass - Montreux/Chillon - Martigny - Gd St-Bernard Pass - Aosta. The medieval town of Aosta with many Roman buildings (theatre!) as well as the many Aosta Valley castles are real gems.
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Old Oct 30th, 2014, 12:46 PM
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One route to Torino could go via Chamonix, France - a wonderful Alpine resort with awesome stuff rivaling anything in Switzerland - good for a few days - then take the bus thru a long tunnel but if you are packed light you can take the thrilling aerial cable way between Chamonix and Italy, coming down in the Aosta Valley with trains to Torino.

The Martigny-Chamonix Railway is one of the iconic scene Swiss rail routes and is dramatically Alpine at many places.

If doing much train travel investigate a Swiss Pass that covers not only trains but city transit, postal buses (you can take one from Brig up and over the Simplon Pass to Domodossola, Italy to rejoin the main rail route to Milan) - passes also cover lake boats (be sure to do one on either lake bookending Interlaken!) and grants free entry to 470+ Swiss Museums, including the popular Ballenberg Open-air Museum in the Interlaken area.

The pass would also be fully valid to Chamonix, France even on the French portion. the pass is also fully valid up to Wengen - making it useful if doing day trips down from there and around the wide Jungfrau Region and gives 50% off on most cable ways and mountain trains to mountain tops (but only 25% Wengen-Kl Schiedegg-Jungfraujoch) - all others 50% or fully covered (like cable ways to Murren and Gimmelwald - that's a great day out from Wengen - take the train down to Lauterbrunnen

then thrilling aerial cable way to Grutschalp a few thousand feet above the Lauterbrunnen Valley - train Grutschalp to Murren - do the Murren to Schilthorn/Piz Gloria cable way - one of the longest in the Alps and another thrill - then back to Murren - cable down to Gimmelwald - be sure to stop for a short time at least to savor this amazing out in the middle of nowhere placd - then a cable way that plunges back down the the Lauterbrunnen Valley for postal buses back to Lauterbrunnen and train up to Wengen.

Everything on that loop - my favorite one in the whole region - is fully covered by a Swiss Pass except Murren to Schilthorn/Piz Gloria is 50% off.

For lots of sweet info on Swiss trains and passes (and things like the Half-Fare Card, Swiss Card, Swiss Transfer Ticket, etc which can be better for some than a pass) check out these IMO info-laden sites: www.swisstravelsystem.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.
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Old Oct 30th, 2014, 03:44 PM
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Thank you PalenQ and neckervd for your information.
neckervd, do I understand that for this route...Meiringen - Swiss Post Bus - Grimsel Pass - Furka Pass - Gotthard Pass - train - Milan - Turin...the 3 passes mentioned are by train or by bus? If we followed this, how long would this take? Or would we need to break it up somewhere?
PalenQ, thanks for the cable trips....sounds like a wonderful time while we are in Wengen. (I do love roller coasters, within reason )
Pam
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Old Oct 31st, 2014, 09:20 AM
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To take the three passes bus itinerary would take most of the day and then only get you to Brig where you'd have to take the long tunnel just to get to Milan/Turin that day.

I have taken the three pass bus tour and it's neat but the Simplon Pass postal bus route IME was even more thrilling and can easily be put in a day from Wengen-Interlaken-spiez-Brig - Simplon bus - Domodossola - Turin.
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Old Oct 31st, 2014, 11:11 AM
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Note that the three pass bus trip is an excursion you do on your own from Meiringen and back to Meiringen - doing a triangle of rugged Alpine passes - a nice day out if into Alpine bus rides on sinuously twisting roads with the iconic postal buses blowing their unique horns at every hairpin turn!

But one mid-September when I was there and got to Meiringen to take off I learned that snow had blocked some passes the night before - I had to wait until the next day to do it - so you cannot count on this for sure at that time of year. The simplon Pass bus I believe goes year-round.
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Old Oct 31st, 2014, 01:07 PM
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There are tons of 3Pass combinations. I meant:
Train: Wengen dp 9.03 - Lake Brienz - Meiringen ar 10.36
Postbus: Meiringen dp 10.50 - Grimsel Pass - Gletsch - Furka Pass Rhone Glacier Ice Cave ar 12.53, dp 14.02 - Andermatt ar 14.52, dp 15.45 - Gotthard Pass - Airolo ar 16.45
Train: Airolo dp 16.59 - Leventina Valley - Bellinzona ar 17.53, dp 18.00 - Lake Lugano - Como - Milano Centrale ar 19.35, dp 20.06 - Turin PN ar 21.50
No tunnel longer than 2 miles along the whole itinerary!
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Old Oct 31st, 2014, 01:47 PM
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If you have a Swiss Pass it was last I took one 10 CHF (Swiss francs) for an Alpine supplement on postal buses going over passes. neckervd - do postal buses need reservations and do you know if the 10 franc Alpine supplement is per bus ride or for a whole day of various buses?
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Old Oct 31st, 2014, 05:47 PM
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Thanks again both of you, for these ideas. I finally figured out (I think) the sbb.ch site and found two other choices by train, each 5.5 hours, roughly. One is Interlaken - Spiez - Domodossola - Novara - Turin the other Interlaken - Spiez - Brig - Milano Centrale - Turin
Are either of you familiar with either of these? Seems they include part of the routes you have mentioned.
Thanks again......Pam
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Old Nov 1st, 2014, 08:24 AM
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Ok, my husband did additional research on the train connections I mentioned in my last post. Part of the trip is through the Simplon tunnel. He really would rather we go over the Alps rather than through them.....in 1962 his family traveled from Brig to Milan over the Alps through the Aletsch glacier (cog rail) by train. Is that possible? Is it part of one of the routes you mentioned?
Thanks (again)... Pam
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Old Nov 1st, 2014, 08:33 AM
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Just for your info:

I booked a ticket from Arth-Goldau to Torino and back (not on the same day) and paid SFr. 170.
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Old Nov 1st, 2014, 11:11 AM
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Thank you kleeblatt...we will check that out. Did you book it through sbb.ch? Do you know the length of the trip? We will follow up on that......
thanks, Pam
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Old Nov 1st, 2014, 12:01 PM
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Well, because I live in Switzerland, I have a halfprice card for Swiss trains. I booked it through the SBB. The Italian trains might have been cheaper using the trenitalia website, but it was a bit complicated and I booked tickets for 5 people.
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Old Nov 1st, 2014, 02:41 PM
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kleebatt : Thanks for this, I found it on the SBB site....looks good....we may break it up, going Lauterbrunnen to Luzern, a couple of days in Luzern, then Luzern - Arth Goldau and on to Torino. Sounds like a beautiful journey.
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Old Nov 2nd, 2014, 02:44 AM
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Postbus: the alpine supplement (not always 10 CHF) has been abolished. Seat reservation is not compulsory, but advisable in high season if you board a bus at a intermediate stop (like Gletsch).

Domodossola - Novara trains: charming slow trains along Lake Orta, stopping a lot. Dearty cheap: 7 EUR/pax; tickets available at Domodossola railway station The journey time is not longer than via Milan, because the itinerary via Lake Orta is much shorter.

Travel over the Alps:
All the itineraries I mentioned in my previous post go OVER the Alps.
If you prefer to travel via Domodossola, you may do the following:
Wengen dp 8.33 - Spiez ar 9.50, dp 10.12 by train LOETSCHBERGER via Kandersteg - Goppenstein to Brig ar 11.24, dp 11.35 by Postbus to Simplon Pass - Domodossola ar 13.17. Have lunch at Domodossola and walk a bitg around this charming small Italian town. Domodossola dp 15.57 via Lake Orta to Novara ar 17.53, dp 17.59 - Turin ar 20.10
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Old Nov 2nd, 2014, 07:25 AM
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Aletsch Glacier:
3 cableways go from the cog railway line Visp - Brig - Oberwald - Goeschenen to the Aletsch Glacier area:
Moerel - Riederalp Mitte - Moosfluh
Betten - Bettmeralp - Bettmergrat
Fiesch - Fiescheralp - Eggishorn.
The Glacier is just a few hundred meters below Moosfluh, Bettmergrat and Eggishorn. Best hiking trails up to the glacier from Moosfluh and Fiescheralp; good shoes or mountain boots needed.
The cog railway line can be reached from Wengen either
via Loetschberg Base TUNNEL - Brig:
Wengen dp 6.03 - Moerel ar 8.33 - Betten ar 8.39 - Fiesch ar 8.55 and then every hr, change trains at Lauterbrunnen, Interlaken Ost, Spiez and Visp (resp. Brig if you have to store luggage)
or via Grimsel PASS:
Wengen dp 7.33 - Meiringen dp 9.25 - Oberwald dp 12.12 - Fiesch ar 12.53 - Betten ar 14.15 - Moerel ar 14.22, change at Lauterbrunnen, Interlaken Ost, Meiringen and Oberwald
Last departure from Fiesch to Turin (via Simplon TUNNEL - Milan): Fiesch dp 18.56.
Luggage storage possible at Brig only.
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Old Nov 2nd, 2014, 07:43 AM
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If you travel via Lucerne - Arth-Goldau, you will definitely see nothing of the Alps (except the short leg Interlaken - Bruenig).
Best connection:
Lucerne dp 8.47 - Turin ar 15.10, Fare for the Italian leg 26 EUR, standard fare for the Swiss leg 50 EUR, half fare with Half Fare Card, free with Swiss Pass.
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Old Nov 2nd, 2014, 08:57 AM
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If you travel via train via Spiez to Brig you also see nothing of the Alps since now it is almost all in tunnel - you could take the old rail route up and over the Lotschberg old tunnel - a short tunnel - this line with regional trains is awesomely gorgeous - it takes about an hour longer but no long tunnel - at Brig you could take the simplon postal bus to Domodossola but that would take a lot lot longer then yes the long tunnel.

No matter how you try to avoid the tunnel it will take a lot lot longer if bent on going to Torino the same day - or simply stop in say Stresa on Lake Maggiore - a nice lakeside town with the three famous Borromean Island just off shore. Make two easy days of it and avoid all tunnels and go up and over the Alps but in one day it would be a long long day.
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Old Nov 3rd, 2014, 05:27 AM
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"you could take the old rail route up and over the Lotschberg old tunnel - a short tunnel - this line with regional trains is awesomely gorgeous - it takes about an hour longer but no long tunnel - at Brig you could take the simplon postal bus to Domodossola but that would take a lot lot longer then yes the long tunnel"

I gave the timetable above:
"Wengen dp 8.33 - Spiez ar 9.50, dp 10.12 by train LOETSCHBERGER via Kandersteg - Goppenstein to Brig ar 11.24, dp 11.35 by Postbus to Simplon Pass - Domodossola ar 13.17. Have lunch at Domodossola and walk a bit around this charming small Italian town. Domodossola dp 15.57 via Lake Orta to Novara ar 17.53, dp 17.59 - Turin ar 20.10"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0G28yjNZ8LU
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Old Nov 3rd, 2014, 11:27 AM
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Well for most folks 8:30 am to 8:10 pm will be a very long day even with a two-hour lunch but a great route avoiding tunnels is what neckervd has outlined.
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