Germany and Switzerland

Old Jan 26th, 2015, 10:35 AM
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Germany and Switzerland

I am taking a trip from April 25 - May 9 and wish to be efficient in my travels. We are a couple in our mid 50s and have travelled to Europe many times. We prefer to stay at a home base for a few days, see the surrounding areas and then move to the next base. We enjoy history, various cultures, great food and wine, museums, etc.

I currently plan on flying into FRA, staying in the Rhine River area for 3 days, in St. Goar, then 3 days in the Mosel area, in Cochem. I then hope to travel to Switzerland and stay 3 nights in Interlaken, 3 nights in Montruex and finish with 2 nights in Geneva, where I will fly out the next day.

Would any of you suggest altering my plans? Thanks in advance for your interest and assistance.
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Old Jan 26th, 2015, 10:41 AM
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Be sure to Lander Tickets for travels in a concentrated area - two or more can all travel all day on regional trains for about 30 euros or less and also on any citry transport. Not sure how K-D boats on The Rhine are covered with it or not - maybe a discount anyway www.k-d.com tells all about those popular boat rides thru the Rhine Gorge and past the fabled Lorelie.

For Switzerland it seems an 8-consecutive-day Swiss Pass may be the best ticket to ride - covering virtually all transportation from when you get there to when you get gone - covers not only trains bus lake boats, postal buses, city trams and buses and also gets free entry to some 470 Swiss museums.

for lots of great info on Swiss trains - www.swisstravelsystem.com; for European and Swiss trains in general www.seat61.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com are great sources.

I'd consider cutting a day off both the Rhine and Mosel (and doing only one base city like Cochem and putting a couple of days in Freibourg and the Black Forest en route to Switzerland via Basle.
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Old Jan 26th, 2015, 12:37 PM
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About the K-d boat - about the only company running several boats a day May thru mid October and one service, subject to demand, in winter -- I recommend boarding the boat in Rudesheim, where many cruises originate and get the best seats - those up front on the bow railing where you can see each side of the river and to get a good seat in general as at Rudesheim many tour bus groups swarm aboard - best them to the punch and head to the top deck front - and cruise downstream to Koblenz (upstream services can take much longer - I've been on these boats many times and often many get bored as is it - especially teen-agers (who see little of the cruise except their I-phones!
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 04:34 AM
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"Would any of you suggest altering my plans?"
All depends on your interests:
there are stunning museums and temporary exhibitons in other towns of Germany and Switzerland than the mentioned one's;
the hills above Montreux are full of blooming white narcissus flowers in the 2nd week of May, if you like that, you will be fine;
in the Interlaken area, there will still be snow above about 2000 metres;
may be you visit Trier (and the roman excavations there) and reach Switzerland via Strasbourg instead of backtracking via Koblenz - Mainz....
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 05:34 AM
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The trip from St. Goar to Interlaken is a long one - 6.5+ hours - and longer yet from Cochem. Maybe you want to visit Cochem first and St. Goar next.

Besides, you might want to overnight in St. Goar (5 train minutes from Oberwesel) on April 30 since Weinhexennacht is happening in Oberwesel. It's a wine fest whereby a straw wine witch is torched and a new wine witch crowned as a way of welcoming the new season. Wine stands, music, food, fireworks...
http://www.oberwesel.de/typo3temp/pics/a89a4b40bd.jpg

A boat ride that includes Koblenz wastes a lot of time because of the less-interesting scenery near there and because the dock in Koblenz is a long walk from the train station. That cruise would take 4 hours or 6 hours depending on which way you cruise the river. You're best off cruising with the current (south) from Rüdesheim or Bingen to St. Goar. That takes about 1.5 hours and you'll see the best part of the river. St. Goar therefore makes for a smart base town. You catch a train south to Bingen and cruise north from there back to your base.

Getting around on the Rhine and Mosel by train (and bus) can be done on a variety of local passes. A 3-day VRM mini-group pass costs €43.60. The Rheinland-Pfalz ticket day pass costs €28 for two and has a wider area of validity. Check those options out here:
http://www.vrminfo.de/en/tickets-and...eisure-ticket/

I wouldn't reduce the Mosel/Rhine time at all. There's an absolute ton of things to see and do there. And if you get lazy it's a great area to relax and enjoy a bike ride and the scenery.
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 06:53 AM
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Don't neglect Koblenz IMO - at least the area where the K0-d boat dumps you off - the Rhine Ufer there is very nice - usually a lot of strolleers on this riverside walkway that leads to in a few minutes Deutsches Eck - the "German Unity Corner" that is very famous in Germany and attracts swarms to this equestrian statue of a huge plinth right smack at the confluence of the 'Mother Mosel' and ' Father Rhine' - very scenic spot -

Across the river rises a cliff topped by an old military fort - tunnels are hewn out that you can walk up top for a fine fine view for miles around - as nice to me as anything on the Rhine south of here. A pedestrian ferry crosses from the Deutsches Eck area to the fort entrance and there is also an aerial cable way there.

And Koblenz has a very inviting Altstadt or Old Town - filled with restaurants, beer hall, etc and one of the nicer pedestrian shopping zones I have seen in Germany - consider staying on the boat to Koblenz and spending a few hours in this often maligned for some reason nice but yes large town.
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 06:54 AM
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Images of Deutsches Eck:

https://www.google.com/search?q=deut...ih=977&dpr=1.1
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 07:21 AM
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After numerous visits to Koblenz, I have not been sold - the villages are generally more worthy of your time IMO - but if you are sold on Koblenz as a destination, don't waste your time on the boat - as PalenQ says, the cruise gets boring - take the train. It's just 20 minutes (vs. 2 hours longer by boat!) from St. Goar to Koblenz by direct train. And if you are using a train day pass like I suggested above, you can ride bus 1 from the station to the Deutches Eck and the old town for free (the ride takes about 13 minutes - walking much longer.)

It would also be possible to visit Koblenz as you move between Cochem and St. Goar. If traveling by train, just drop bags in a station locker before you board Bus 1.
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 09:06 AM
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https://www.google.com/search?q=fort...w=1455&bih=977

I think the Ehrenbreitstein Fortress is quite a sight and the view from up top even finer - now that is if you have 3 days in the area - 3 days just in Rhine towns could bore many - like many of the thousand or so folks I've taken on tours there in the past (not recently however but things don't change that much) but for the non-casual traveler yes three days could be nice - climbing up thru vineyards, exploring the towns, etc but in that 3 days I would suggest at least a look at Koblenz' Deutsches Eck and fortress. But it certainly is not a 'must' sight.
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 10:13 AM
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"3 days just in Rhine towns could bore many - like many of the thousand or so folks I've taken on tours there "

Hmm. That makes me wonder why you took them there. When you took those 1,000 plus folks on tours, did you offer up some of the places below? Maybe they expected a torrid nightlife scene (you can pretty much forget that in the Rhine villages!) Or were they stuck on a cruise boat all the time? Now that could end up to be boring, but it's hard to see why they wouldn't find the rest of the Rhine pretty interesting...

http://flyhahn.com/regions/romantic-...te-germany.htm

(check the video on above page too.)

Castles:
http://www.welterbe-mittelrheintal.d...php?id=288&L=3

Dozens of wineries: http://www.mittelrhein-wein.com/winz...erurlaub06.pdf

Chairlifts and views...

In Boppard:
http://www.boppard-tourismus.de/24-1-Sesselbahn.html
http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/med...king-rhein.jpg
(Also in Rüdesheim)

Easy biking with great scenery: http://www.gastlandschaften.de/filea...a52eb71b8e.jpg

This place on the Nahe River a short distance from the Rhine is outstanding:
http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attractio...neland_Pa.html
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Old Jan 27th, 2015, 10:19 AM
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I'm talking about an average casual traveler and we were on bikes - don't get me wrong - lots of time can be spent on the Rhine - personally I like the Rhine more than the Mosel but most folks I knew did not - I like the energy of the 'Father Rhine' the constant horns on the incessant freighter and cruise ships in the narrowest part of the Rhine - by the Lorelei - the noise of trains trundling down each bank (I'm a rail nut) - the Mosel is just too picture postcard and somnolent for me - but I'm just saying what most I took thru there felt - they found the Mosel much more relaxing - 3 days in each will be great for the sophisticated traveler who does their homework and then will be thrilled - thanks to you and your very informative posts they have a lot of ideas.
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 02:00 AM
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Thank you all for your kind suggestions, very helpful. Any thoughts on where to day trip when I am in Interlaken and Montruex?
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 03:36 AM
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Hi pkadams,

I visit Montreux often (watch the spelling for any google searches you do .. !). Here are links to "reviews" (w/photos) of my favorite activities there:

Montreux old town
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Lavaux
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Walks through the Lavaux vineyards
http://www.montreuxriviera.com/en/Cu...rekking_Lavaux

Promenade Fleuri
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Morges
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...rges_Vaud.html

Gruyeres
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR..._Fribourg.html

Saanen
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...wiss_Alps.html

Gstaad
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...wiss_Alps.html

I strongly suggest you take the Golden Pass route between Interlaken and Montreux -- you don't need to take the marketed Golden Pass, as any train on that route (via Gstaad) will have outstanding views. However, if you do want to take the GP, you should go for the VIP seats.

Let us know if you have specific questions --

Have fun as you plan!

s
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 04:27 AM
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Swan, thanks so much for your guidance, I truly appreciate it. Does anyone have some day trip suggestions from Interlaken?
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 05:49 AM
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pk - By day trip do you mean all the mountain adventures you can have in the surrounding area? Check any web site bout the Berner Oberland for hikes, cable cars, etc. I recommend Schnygge Platte.

We will be in Interlaken in September and I've just asked a question about going to Saas Fee and Brig for a day trip. You can click on my name and see if anyone answers this question. However, if you've never been to the BO before, there is plenty to do right there.
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 07:31 AM
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Rain can set in in the B O anytime - even in summer - several days at a time in the past few years - so rainy day day trips to places like Bern - vastly underrated city IMO - or over the Brunig Pass to Lucerne - cities that are better in wet weather than trekking around the B O.
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Old Jan 28th, 2015, 11:46 AM
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Boat trips on the lakes are favorite day trips from any BO base for me - Lake Thun or Lake Brienz - severl places around each lake to get off and exp;lore and re-board later boats. On a nice day just take a boat ride to nowehre to relax in the sun - bring any food or drink onboard, etc. Swisspasses are valid on most all lake boats - Eurailpasses are several main lakes but not all.
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Old Feb 9th, 2015, 04:52 AM
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Can anyone suggest the better base town of St. Goar or Bacharach? I prefer a bit less touristy and more dining options.
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Old Feb 9th, 2015, 05:35 AM
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Can anyone suggest the better base town of St. Goar or Bacharach? I prefer a bit less touristy and more dining options.

North Americans tend toward those two places, especially Bacharach, both of which are somewhat touristy but still OK IMO overall. For a somewhat more German experience I'd suggest staying in Boppard, a very fine town with lots of eateries. Though visited by tourists it is less dependent on the tourist trade overall than Bacharach and St. Goar and more frequented by locals and German tourists - and it has more accommodations and dining choices.

Boppard: http://www.wliw.org/21pressroom/file...11/Boppard.jpg

Boppard town square: http://static.panoramio.com/photos/large/9532687.jpg

Old town street by cathedral: http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/p...m/89118425.jpg

Tea house in Boppard's old town: http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2769/4...c5c8b305_o.jpg

Boppard restaurants: http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restauran...alatinate.html

Weinhaus Römerburg in Boppard gets good marks from its GERMAN and other European guests as well as Non-European tourists. some of the structure dates from ancient Rome:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...%B6merburg.JPG
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Old Feb 9th, 2015, 09:40 AM
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In any Rhine hotel make sure your room does not face the railway or the main road - noise all night as the recent NYTimes article documented for the Rhine gorge.
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